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All had an excusable President Obama blasting actions taken -- IRS after report came out from the treasury department's inspector general.
Finding that conservative groups were indeed targeted -- appropriately the attorney general Eric Holder who will testify on Capitol Hill a couple of hours on this.
Ordered the FBI to investigate.
The scandal congress will also hear from the acting IRS commissioner Steve Miller.
On Friday and hearing about all this.
Joining us -- debate and discussed.
Today secular General Counsel with the American center pro law and justice.
And -- Bannister formal criminal investigation division special agent Ed yes RB IRS.
We're gonna start with you first Josef.
How much of this you see as being just blatantly illegal what was going on -- us.
Quite a bit actually.
I saw that there was at least nine possible disclosure violations were by the IRS shared.
Nine applications before they've been approved with faith a private group called pro -- All kinds of treasury rules of conduct there were no doubt violated.
Not to mention just the trust of the American people.
Violating the -- -- mission statement to be fair and unbiased.
It runs the gamut there are so many rules and laws that have been violated its not funny.
Now I know that dormant Jackson want to talk about all the politics and NASA may be that way on -- those legal statements.
Had -- Joseph was talked about the here that was done illegally it seems like every day and today before it's done may be counted in this as well as we hear more as we find out more about the scandal the scope of -- Is wider and I guess the legal questions are -- along with -- what do you make at all.
Well I think that's right I actually began -- a -- career as a -- for the office of chief counsel.
For the Internal Revenue Service and other tax exempt group was one of our clients within that group.
And as was just said there's numerous violations both of the internal revenue manual of existing federal law.
A potentially criminal law including conspiracy deprive individuals of their civil rights.
And the fact of the matter is I don't think this is gonna get better does not like a fine wine that's -- -- well.
Hi this is gonna get worse as more information is out there -- IG's report the inspector general.
Focused on three issues that I think are significant number one clearly there was targeting the IRS has confessed that.
They made an apology on behalf of the 27 clients are representative biology is not accepted.
But that -- made an apology they acknowledge targeting secondly I think this is significant also.
The inspector general said the agents in charge of this.
We're not familiar enough with the actual law between 501 C threes and -- -- in the inner workings of the internal revenue code which is more than troubling considering.
These are the agents charged with both.
Approving these kind of organizations and ultimately some of them auditing these organizations down the road so that was troubling in and three of course.
As the IG stated that a number of the questions that were -- were not only burdensome.
But also up in violation of existing law membership -- donor data that kind of information so I think there's a virtual you know -- smorgasbord.
-- violations here and I think the seriousness of it is gonna get.
More pronounced with time.
Let's hope the calls -- Roy looking through this report.
It does not answer who came up with this idea exactly right and where did this idea come from and I thought it was okay that this was going home and.
Yeah this is not to from all I can judge two through people sitting cubicle say hey let's get back if he's right wing groups.
It's an enormous scope 471.
Groups apparently were targeted and that takes a lot of effort lot of manpower.
Did somebody dream this up on his -- some somebody on high -- be good -- stick into the Tea Party and groups on the right.
And what I really fear ultimately what this -- -- this is doing right now or maybe -- fear into the thing is it's raising the level of distrust of him among the American people towards IRS.
As you know -- Obama care coming down the pike.
I think -- 151000 IRS agents -- going to be hired basically to enforce obamacare we've already found out this group pro public has been getting files from a six different groups that were confidential.
They publicize some misinformation -- that some of the names.
Apparently there was a I pro marriage group that had its information passed -- -- and a pro gay marriage group that was -- about embarrassment that organization.
And it raises the question if if you have the federal government -- getting people's medical records electronic records we -- the congressman so and so takes Viagra and -- such and such fixing any anxiety.
Medication may be some cabinet secretary is -- see a psychiatrist because of violent fantasies well who knows what kind of very very -- of confidential information could get out be used for political purposes.
Story Murdoch parents did it because you're staying with this because -- is relative last word on this subject before we move on to our next one.
To Joseph banister and this question how high up it goes and it's true at this point that we don't.
Quite know I mean any sense of that from where you set.
Well certainly the treasury report indicated that there were -- you know dozens and dozens of people involved and so.
As Apple's already said.
What why is who's thinking up these things who thinks like this people ET -- RS agent takes an oath to support and defend the constitution.
And apparently they don't even know what it is and missiles pointed out that he is a so called determination units specialists.
Don't even know the very laws that they're supposed to be evaluating so it's really it's an evil agency and I hope the American people get up in arms about it.
Jean-Sebastien thank you very much appreciate you coming -- assignments as I said to Ryan was.
And -- to stay with us and attacked earlier at the top about having.
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