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-- Gordon Chang as an author of nuclear showdown.
North Korea takes on the world released by random house when do you think.
Seven years ago January 2006.
-- his first book the coming collapse of China also published by.
-- miles in 2001.
Now -- joins us now on the telephone which means -- -- -- to take the American makeup.
In imminent coffee.
And make small talk performer talked to him -- -- -- good morning mr.
Good morning we're Euribor.
Fly your wife -- to us today at fox.
I know she's the one who lost her diamond ring -- That was why we weren't there -- -- couple times ago.
-- -- -- Well first photographing salute those son of the federal standards there and north through the -- -- -- -- there what general talked all about.
Well he blew up pretty powerful device and that means they've -- state technical threshold.
This is important -- -- this because in December they cost a critical technical threshold.
When they had that three stage missile which can reach Alaska Hawaii and may -- may be.
Parts of Canada and the northern part of our West Coast.
So the north Koreans are making a lot of technical improvements which means -- they're going to be a real threat pretty soon.
But differences time -- sort of where uranium power does not plan.
Well we think -- it's going to be uranium but we haven't sniffed it out yet and this is important because the north Koreans only have so much plutonium.
-- means every time they test they have a little bit less.
But uranium they can make as much of it as they want and also -- the re Indians have a uranium program.
And the north Koreans sell everything that they perfect.
To Iran which means that if this -- -- uranium -- yesterday it means probably the Iranians are gonna get it but not too distant future.
Now talking to Mike Baker yesterday and operations -- -- And he talked a lot about the around.
On North Korea all connection.
Does so you think that's so so you think just what they do there are you know about -- to -- North Korean sullen look around and information.
-- because he can remember in September 2007 the Israelis destroyed in North Korea reactor in Syria.
Well the Syrian student paper -- they didn't have the money.
Iran paid for -- North Korea has sold process uranium to Iran had.
And all those missiles that are -- has those overall North Korean missiles which have been repainted and renamed.
So North Korea sells everything it has to the Iranians.
Wonder what kind of encouragement north to -- from China -- a -- brought on.
They get a lot because North Korea can't sell the missiles without sending them over Chinese airspace.
And we know that because of WikiLeaks.
We also know that the Chinese have sold.
Materials to the Iranians for their nuclear weapons program.
Given them some technology directly and indirectly.
So China is behind both Iran and North Korea.
What Brasilia one -- -- Chinese tell also.
A bottle else.
Well they tell us they the other -- then there actually.
They they say that they can't control the north Koreans.
And there are a lot of -- ministry professionals and academics in Beijing who.
Who really know that China's policy towards North Korea's.
He's not in China's long term interest but unfortunately there are a lot of military officers and some Communist Party officials.
Who really believe that -- should stand behind North Korea and just a few hours ago.
China's official media -- the United States for all that's going on in North Korea.
So these two countries are still standing together side by side Communist brother's going back more than six decades.
Talking whether Gordon -- -- Sharon Burnham live -- work in China.
At a Hong Kong for almost twenty -- most recently and Shanghai.
As counsel to one of the great America law -- Paul why small folks.
All won't say that.
China took a dim view of those what -- what the world what realistically -- editor of.
Well they could shut down North Korea pretty fast -- China supplies 90%.
North Korea's energy 80% of consumer goods.
Of food most of that on concessionary terms.
China is the only country that consistently stands behind North Korea in the Security Council and and other diplomatic forums.
You know the Chinese are there to keep North Korea going and that they -- Kim Jong -- would have to stop all of his weapons program to -- country probably would fall apart.
Because China is funding it.
So maybe I'm not paying close enough attention to those.
Usually only -- world -- -- -- -- not just from zero but.
Was -- still somewhat toward in my mind -- to wander around that -- -- near.
We're -- talking about some grocers -- start thinking about someone else.
Never more -- should never never.
-- of course perhaps solid and by the way -- -- -- -- But anyway for -- But.
Tell me again why president China's interests encourages.
War -- -- well because the principle there's no consensus to change policy and in China that you need consensus to change the policy.
But the reason why it's in China's interest -- -- short term is that every time North Korea -- is that a provocation.
We go to Beijing and ask them to rein in North Korea and the Chinese extract concessions from us.
So -- short term Beijing thinks that this is terrific.
No long term this is really bad for China.
For any number of different reasons because it drives countries in the region in -- our arms.
It just creates enemies for Beijing but short term they really get a lot of advantage from all of this.
By mention it back in 2001 random house published.
Your -- Told him in the coming collapse of China.
-- -- -- -- their original ones are gonna collapse.
Well in that book in 2000 what I said it would take a decade which is 2011 so -- a year and a half out of time.
But right now in -- we see some really serious problems including an economy which is growing at only half the rate that Beijing claims.
We see the Chinese military breaking free of civilian control we see a lot of protests in the streets.
And so the Communist Party leaders think that their system is pretty fragile we know that from what they're doing.
So should we be happy -- an American.
Does not necessarily because as China becomes more fragile its foreign policy is becoming more hostile and belligerent.
And that's why we see all these problems now with Japan which are really getting quite serious we see -- backing North Korea.
We see China trying to take territory away from India.
This is not a good story and countries in the region are very concerned about what China's doing which is the reason why they've been running to Washington seeking help you.
Our relationship -- Japan is dead -- -- -- Well it's getting a look at that well it's getting troublesome in this sense that the Chinese are trying to take these islands away from the Japanese and we have a mutual defense treaty with Tokyo which means that.
If the Chinese actually try to grab them we have an obligation to rush to Japan's defense which means that we get involved.
In their territorial dispute.
Thanks for room and everybody morning.
Our business and a -- -- nightmare.
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