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-- look back at 2009.
Is seen by a lot of people was more than 800 billion dollars of wasted money.
Creating far fewer jobs than it could -- and not doing a whole lot to speed up our economic recovery but a new book.
Is turning all those criticisms on its head and hammering the media.
Us for fueling -- joining us now to discuss his book the new new deal.
Is Michael Grunwald got a copy of the book right here the magazine's.
Time magazine senior correspondent and author.
Of the new new deal mr.
Grunwald thank you for joining us -- his heart.
With a quote you gave slate which she said when you spent 800 billion dollars on an economic recovery in the cut recovery stinks.
People don't tend to look past that.
Why should that.
It's true you know.
People forget that and -- in 2009 when Obama took over.
The financial earthquake -- hit but the economic tsunami hadn't reached the shore you know we've we've lost 9% of our GDP in the fourth quarter of 2008.
Lost 800000 jobs in 2000 not ended January 2009.
But the unemployment rate still wasn't that high.
-- right after the stimulus passed in February he had the biggest improvement in jobs in thirty years but improved from absolutely hideous to just bad.
And it's hard to get people excited about that.
And so let me let me point out as you've said in interviews about the book that people on the left are going to well some -- like get.
Those who wanted a bigger stimulus will -- -- people on the right will hate this book.
Mostly you're saying that attention -- -- being drawn appropriately to what the stimulus -- let me read from your book the Recovery Act helped ease a lot of pain.
And helped avert a depression that would have caused immeasurable pain.
Modest growth while frustrating has been.
Infinitely preferable to hellacious contraction like Romer said.
Depressions really really sock.
Lot of people unemployed are going to agree with that and say your book is wrong that the stimulus.
Does not help.
Well look I -- 25% unemployment would be worse then than 8% unemployment.
And losing the 150000.
Jobs a month that we're gaining now.
There's a lot better than the 800000 jobs a month that we were losing.
At the same time the recovery acted all these things that people don't realize what was actually -- Nationalists are about what it did what -- what kinds of things really not -- distillation of change of what Obama meant by change.
It poured ninety billion dollars in to clean energy when we were spending a few billion year.
Included race to the top the most dramatic education reform in decades.
It's dragging our antiquated pen and paper health care system and the digital age.
It's the biggest investment in infrastructure since Eisenhower.
The biggest middle class tax cut since Reagan the biggest investments in research ever and none of that has really gotten much attention because look.
Republicans have done a great job portraying it as 800 billion dollars worth of mob museums and.
You know levitating trains to Disneyland in all kinds of nonsense that's not and it and Democrats haven't really been -- -- still -- And defendant so my mama's gonna have really why questionable -- -- if it's been as successful as you make the argument in your book.
Why are Democrats talking about.
Who call I think there's one in some sense -- -- via the cake is already -- right a year after the stimulus passed.
The percentage of Americans who believed it was created jobs was lower than the percentage of Americans who believe Elvis was alive.
Hey Philip if you look at all the independent economists they say that it added about two to 4% to GDP.
Which is the difference between contraction in growth probably created two to three million jobs.
We had an eight million job hole and people who -- interested in hearing about that it's doubling renewable energy.
That it's in a reformist laying the ground work for Health Care Reform that it's reforming education.
In ways that even.
Jeb Bush and Mitch Daniels of had support -- -- made lifted seven million people out of poverty I understand I understand the statistics but you made a comment in another interview that for instance the electrical the electric vehicle industry is here because of stimulus.
And a lot of people would say to that comment.
The electric vehicle industry was here before stimulus Toyota was selling Prius Honda was selling.
Electric vehicles long before the economic Lazarus there's a -- -- Those are hybrid hybrids like hybrids either deal these are the all electric vehicles -- and what he went absolutely -- is that there's now going to be a domestic US.
Electric battery industry where they poured two billion dollars into it and helped.
With which also raised a few billion dollars in private capital and -- got thirty electric battery factories in this country were before you -- none with the capacity to.
To do half a million electric cars again it's not the only thing they're doing they're also doing advanced biofuels.
They're making internal and combustion engines more.
More efficient they're doing wind and solar and geothermal and this.
Let me -- direct downer cola gonna get yeah -- learned -- top I I -- wrapped up quote from your book.
Families businesses and governments were all saddled with debt leaving virtually no demand in the economy deleveraging takes time -- -- restoring confidence.
If we settled the future generations with debt -- -- we ever climb out of -- -- Well look at me Malia and Obama didn't.
Hired a one point two trillion dollar deficit -- hasn't really ground.
But what really makes deficits big -- is is when people don't have jobs that they don't pay taxes and when.
Corporations are making profits -- they're not paying taxes and depressions me.
And it that would make the deficit explode.
So again things are not as good as they should be but the people who said that -- these big deficits are gonna create inflation in high interest rates.
You know inflation has been low and interest rates have been historically low or no we still have a demand problem and you see what's -- austerity.
That the really severe austerity is done for places like great Britain and Spain have -- right back into a double dip recession.
Alright Michael Grunwald I appreciate your being here and I think we'd all agree there is no politician on the planet who doesn't enjoy a government funded photo -- -- be well.
That's for sure thank you congress is --